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Post by cer on Apr 5, 2020 8:15:32 GMT -5
Going from PBS specials and being signed to Columbia Records to dressing as a kitty in an attempt to revitalize her career is a rather odd turn of events. If you truly are bragging that you have helped JE in any way, are you really happy where JE's career currently stands!? If you are pleased with it, congrats! Well you clearly are a woman, the only posters who ive seen gaslight to that extent are women. When did I say that I had anything to do with her career at all? Explain to me how shes supposed to maintain that level of fame 10 years later? You seem to be under the impression that the Masked Singer is where singers go to revive their career, you read that from Soc who has no knowledge about anything and never has, who even admits he was wrong about Jackie. She comes from reality tv to begin with. She and that so called lousy team made an impressive career with lucky breaks. Plus she can sing. There are some good acts that are well liked, but shes a singer. She might not win, but who cares? Its the best pr money can buy. Better pr than having that non-singer moppet's Dad. If she even knows who that is. Who cares? That dumb one had the opportunity as anyone does in the agt finale to sing with a superstar. Just tell me why she didnt sing with Stevie Nicks? Just answer that. Why she didnt even beg for the opportunity? Even to be a background singer would be an honor. Who the hell cares about her singing True Colors when you cant even sing Landslide? Every singer can sing that. I'm a guy, but that shouldn't matter to you. Jackie's parents have kept her so isolated from other young talents in the entertainment world, she might not have a clue who Grace is. However, I'm fairly confident Jackie knows all about Grace. "Just tell me why she didnt sing with Stevie Nicks? Just answer that. Why she didnt even beg for the opportunity?" Please look at amg1977's answer to this question above. He nails it.
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Post by Beachguy on Apr 5, 2020 8:20:57 GMT -5
One of my most Enjoyable nights on TV ...She is Delightful ...just listen to the people there ..
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Post by cer on Apr 5, 2020 11:32:21 GMT -5
youtu.be/xC6hXevwOA8 One of my most Enjoyable nights on TV ...She is Delightful ...just listen to the people there .. Well done, but unfortunately days long gone bye. Hopefully JE can reignite her career again moving forward.
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Post by Just Somebody on Apr 5, 2020 12:30:58 GMT -5
What is this singer/non-singer business? If you sing for other people, and the audience likes what they hear, what else is there to define “singer” in the music business except to maybe categorize them. There are singers who only sing, there are singers who also write songs, etc. Which of those is more deserving of the word? An opera singer? A crooner? A pop singer? A country singer? A singer-songwriter? There are technical abilities and stylistic choices that may differentiate one from the other, but those are preferences. Whether you prefer one style or genre over another isn’t relevant. I think of Grace as a singer-songwriter, but she’s no less a singer to my ear than anyone else I love listing to. Her voice may not appeal to some but to my ear it’s soothing, warm and emotionally evocative. She is no less a singer than any other singer-songwriter whose voice may not appeal to everyone, like Leonard Cohen, Lara Fabian, Bob Dylan, Neil Young, Carol King, Jackson Browne or Tom Waits. Jackie, who I could sit here and call a “non-songwriter,” has an appealing voice too. It’s all good. The issues raised here with Jackie mostly have to do with career, management, attitude, behavior, stylistic and genre choices, etc., but no one has said she can’t sing.
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Post by Beachguy on Apr 5, 2020 12:44:02 GMT -5
youtu.be/xC6hXevwOA8 One of my most Enjoyable nights on TV ...She is Delightful ...just listen to the people there .. Well done, but unfortunately days long gone bye. Hopefully JE can reignite her career again moving forward. yes yesterday is long gone as the Beatles ...her career started with a spark but things not of music has dampen it but the fire is not out at this age for there are flames that burn a long time .
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Post by cer on Apr 5, 2020 14:00:32 GMT -5
Well done, but unfortunately days long gone bye. Hopefully JE can reignite her career again moving forward. yes yesterday is long gone as the Beatles ...her career started with a spark but things not of music has dampen it but the fire is not out at this age for there are flames that burn a long time . Problem for Jackie, she isn't The Beatles.
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Post by Pin the Tail on Apr 5, 2020 14:06:53 GMT -5
yes yesterday is long gone as the Beatles ...her career started with a spark but things not of music has dampen it but the fire is not out at this age for there are flames that burn a long time . Problem for Jackie, she isn't The Beatles. Neither are you (nor anyone else).
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Post by richard on Apr 5, 2020 14:56:03 GMT -5
What is this singer/non-singer business? If you sing for other people, and the audience likes what they hear, what else is there to define “singer” in the music business except to maybe categorize them. There are singers who only sing, there are singers who also write songs, etc. Which of those is more deserving of the word? An opera singer? A crooner? A pop singer? A country singer? A singer-songwriter? There are technical abilities and stylistic choices that may differentiate one from the other, but those are preferences. Whether you prefer one style or genre over another isn’t relevant. I think of Grace as a singer-songwriter, but she’s no less a singer to my ear than anyone else I love listing to. Her voice may not appeal to some but to my ear it’s soothing, warm and emotionally evocative. She is no less a singer than any other singer-songwriter whose voice may not appeal to everyone, like Leonard Cohen, Lara Fabian, Bob Dylan, Neil Young, Carol King, Jackson Browne or Tom Waits. Jackie, who I could sit here and call a “non-songwriter,” has an appealing voice too. It’s all good. The issues raised here with Jackie mostly have to do with career, management, attitude, behavior, stylistic and genre choices, etc., but no one has said she can’t sing. That is a fact she probably has the best voice of all of them but has been so miss managed. Even at the age of 10 I can remember her saying she doesn't have a pop voice. The only way a 10 year old would say something like that is that it was fed to her. There is no future in CC any longer but she can sing a lot of pop songs as good as anyone but can she make that transition.
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Post by richard on Apr 5, 2020 15:01:51 GMT -5
What is this singer/non-singer business? If you sing for other people, and the audience likes what they hear, what else is there to define “singer” in the music business except to maybe categorize them. There are singers who only sing, there are singers who also write songs, etc. Which of those is more deserving of the word? An opera singer? A crooner? A pop singer? A country singer? A singer-songwriter? There are technical abilities and stylistic choices that may differentiate one from the other, but those are preferences. Whether you prefer one style or genre over another isn’t relevant. I think of Grace as a singer-songwriter, but she’s no less a singer to my ear than anyone else I love listing to. Her voice may not appeal to some but to my ear it’s soothing, warm and emotionally evocative. She is no less a singer than any other singer-songwriter whose voice may not appeal to everyone, like Leonard Cohen, Lara Fabian, Bob Dylan, Neil Young, Carol King, Jackson Browne or Tom Waits. Jackie, who I could sit here and call a “non-songwriter,” has an appealing voice too. It’s all good. The issues raised here with Jackie mostly have to do with career, management, attitude, behavior, stylistic and genre choices, etc., but no one has said she can’t sing. That is a fact she probably has the best voice of all of them but has been so miss managed. Even at the age of 10 I can remember her saying she doesn't have a pop voice. The only way a 10 year old would say something like that is that it was fed to her. There is no future in CC any longer but she can sing a lot of pop songs as good as anyone but can she make that transition. Jackie is competing with other 20 year olds now she can't depend on the cute little girl with the big voice any longer or keep holding onto AGT's coattails and David Foster seemed to have abandoned ship already.
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Post by BOGC on Apr 5, 2020 15:08:06 GMT -5
What is this singer/non-singer business? If you sing for other people, and the audience likes what they hear, what else is there to define “singer” in the music business except to maybe categorize them. There are singers who only sing, there are singers who also write songs, etc. Which of those is more deserving of the word? An opera singer? A crooner? A pop singer? A country singer? A singer-songwriter? There are technical abilities and stylistic choices that may differentiate one from the other, but those are preferences. Whether you prefer one style or genre over another isn’t relevant. I think of Grace as a singer-songwriter, but she’s no less a singer to my ear than anyone else I love listing to. Her voice may not appeal to some but to my ear it’s soothing, warm and emotionally evocative. She is no less a singer than any other singer-songwriter whose voice may not appeal to everyone, like Leonard Cohen, Lara Fabian, Bob Dylan, Neil Young, Carol King, Jackson Browne or Tom Waits. Jackie, who I could sit here and call a “non-songwriter,” has an appealing voice too. It’s all good. The issues raised here with Jackie mostly have to do with career, management, attitude, behavior, stylistic and genre choices, etc., but no one has said she can’t sing. Simplistically, a singer is anyone that sings - whether or not anyone else even hears, let alone likes it. But among professional or near professional amateur entertainers of various sorts, I'd say a singer is someone for whom singing is a significant fraction (say 1/4 or more) of their performing, and who has a reasonable degree of acceptance (regardless of any other standard of quality) of their singing in its own right, such as on a soundtrack album. Someone who does a lot of singing roles in musicals might be a singer, esp. if they occasionally do some non-acting singing; but someone like Sarah Michelle Gellar, who (barely) did her own singing in the one musical Buffy episode (and was quite uncomfortable doing it) probably isn't, save for honorable mention for doing it despite difficulty. And even for someone who sings more readily, if it's not the main thing they do, it shouldn't usually come first on a list of their entertainment functions. Exception: somehow it's usually "singer/songwriter" even if they do quite a bit more writing (for others) than singing.
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Post by Socal Fan on Apr 5, 2020 15:19:13 GMT -5
Simplistically, a singer is anyone that sings - whether or not anyone else even hears, let alone likes it. If a non-singer sings in a forest and no one is around to hear her, does she make a sound?
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Post by BOGC on Apr 5, 2020 15:24:34 GMT -5
The only way a 10 year old would say something like that is that it was fed to her. There is no future in CC any longer but she can sing a lot of pop songs as good as anyone but can she make that transition. I call BS on both points. As a 10-13 y/o, a more or less classical sound stands out a LOT more (much less common at that age than singing pop, at least in this country). One doesn't need to be fed that. Also, while there's some continuum (e.g. some folk can be done in a less formally pronounced classical tone), the techniques are DIFFERENT, and doing them safely also has some differences. At something around the age range that Jackie did so, one can expand from one to the other, progressively, with reasonable risk if competent coaches are used (I'm not talking months here, maybe weeks and occasional reinforcement, not necessarily long-term formal training). But even older singers have had problems performing both techniques safely. And there are definitely cautionary tales about young ones belting; "Annie" must have ruined more than one voice. And there will always be a future in CC or lite classical or something like melodic adult contemporary or power ballad-like show tunes that's in a continuum with CC. No, it will never be anywhere near as big a market as pop (since kind of by definition, pop is a mishmash of what's popular, but isn't so much in some genre other than rock (country, rap, etc) to be called that only); but there are also a LOT less competitors in CC or equivalent for that very reason (and not necessarily because of what they personally like; there are pop singers that like classical too, and vice versa). edit: I'm NOT saying she should sing ONLY CC! Maybe not even MOSTLY CC (although CC is expandable to incorporate some "pop" power ballads and folk); time will tell about that. But f'goodness sakes, Michael Bolton sang some classical, and it didn't make all his fans start puking; so yes, one can do both. edit 2: and anyway, she's sung ONLY 3 arias, and depending on how you group things, one or two dozen other classical songs, or modern or other songs meant to be sung in a classical style (including religious songs, patriotic songs, some soundtrack songs - possibly reworked, as with A Thousand Years done in Italian). The rest of a total of perhaps 120 (what I'm working from - a dedupe of her songs my iTunes - doesn't have all the songs not on any album) is show/movie tunes, POP/light rock, not so light rock, almost jazz (La vie en rose), and a couple that are more or less country. And increasingly she's moved to doing each in a style more nearly typical of its genre. So the whole argument that CC should be thrown under the bus is INSANE, because it's not the majority anyway, unless you take the view that CC can include plenty that isn't strictly classical (i.e. that we're arguing labels and not actual content). ALL that has to happen (on the genre front, as opposed to say more effective publicity) is that it become fairly widely known that not ALL (or even most) of what she does is CC. If they don't TOTALLY bungle it, that should follow fairly easily after the reveal on TMS. As to what will get teens to turn out, that's typically whatever their peers like and their parents range from liking to barely tolerating. And since teens are mostly spending their parent's money, although they may still like those songs, the blend of what they like will probably change when they're earning their own money, let alone when they have their own kids and worry about rotting their kid's brains* with the wrong sort of music. So yes that's a big fraction of pop $$, but it's not even all of pop. I don't personally give a JoJo Siwa ice cream** (which I mean as an analogy to what I recently flushed) about pandering to the teen market, unless the ONLY considerations are $$$$$$$$ or peer age group approval (and the latter means what? when Jackie won't be a teen anymore in four days). * people start with good taste, and f it up later: www.telegraph.co.uk/science/2018/06/12/play-mozart-keep-babies-happy-womb-say-doctors/** being curious, I looked up what the flavor is. Turns out I called it earlier: sugar and bright colors. www.moms.com/walmart-selling-jojo-siwa-sugar-cookie-ice-cream/Probably something the tweenies will outgrow quickly.
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Post by richard on Apr 5, 2020 17:45:02 GMT -5
Lets do compare Jackie and JoJo,s commercial enterprises. I think you will just look silly.
Now that both Jackie's and JoJo's concerts or on hold JoJo still has her commercial line of clothing, toys, electronics, candy and ice cream. What does Jackie have now that she never diversified in anything, so don't laugh at other's that did.
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Post by eulenspiegel on Apr 5, 2020 18:21:59 GMT -5
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Post by BOGC on Apr 5, 2020 18:27:08 GMT -5
Lets do compare Jackie and JoJo,s commercial enterprises. I think you will just look silly. You're talking about $$ and/or publicity, which YOU WIN very easily; I've never questioned that. I'm not. I don't even LIKE celebrity endorsements and brands from ANYBODY (give or take decent looking concert merchandise), or indeed most publicity beyond "here's what I'm doing lately", although I do recognize they are part of how the game is played (and sometimes a significant part of total revenue). I can see a Jackie line of tastefully semi-daring but malfunction-resistant prom gowns as a reasonable thing (I'm NOT saying a likely thing! and clearly that's NOT something I'd be buying!!!) - stuff along the lines of what she's worn in the last 4-5 years, not those wide poofy things she wore earlier so as not to be lost in the lights at a distance (not that I don't like to look at them, but there's just not room for them on a crowded dance floor, and they're clearly about a century older in concept than most modern tastes). But to me the key is that something is for nuanced tastes and well made, rather than form over substance. And there is ALMOST NOTHING promoted to tweens and younger teens (up to at least 15, say) that's nuanced or form over substance (mostly they don't know or care about nuance or quality, since they'll wheedle a replacement out of their parents next year anyway), so I regard profiting off of them as not much different from selling Red Bull and Mountain Dew to Honey Boo Boo's mom to mix into "go juice" for her daughter to amp up to performing energy with (ok, that was a few years ago, but it was hideous). What's nuanced? It's not totally a subjective thing. A few months back I decided to try aquavit (having read of it in various stories). I tried the best I could easily find - Linie - and liked it; it's aged a bit, if unconventionally, and tastes like more than just water, alcohol, and caraway. Total Wine was out of stock more recently, so I tried Aalborg (the basic grade) instead. It's basic, all right. Very uncomplicated. I could have soaked crushed caraway in the cheapest available vodka for a week, filtered the result, and had pretty much the same thing. Probably ok ice cold to clear the palate between bites of stinky fish or lutefisk or some other traditional Scandinavian dish best appreciated by its absence, but not something you'd drink because it tastes good, whereas it's actually plausible (if not particularly customary, I gather) to sip Linie like good whiskey rather than quickly downing a shot at a time. I'll still use the Aalborg in my low-sodium/high potassium barely Bloody Marys, but far less than one would use vodka, so that the caraway flavor adds something but doesn't dominate; I actually favor the reduced alcohol in those anyway. But I won't drink it straight much. Maybe that's like how some pop songs are vapid enough initially that they're improved as remixes.
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